Replies

1. 
   questtools | Jun 28, 2007 06:52am | #1

   Hello SFX,

   My current shop is only slightly smaller than your new shop will be and I have a 1 HP dust collector - it is almost 9 years old.  My machine is rated at 850 CFM (but I don't believe those claimed figures), and I upgraded to the 1 micron upper bag and I use the clear plastic lower bags.

   My 1 HP machine is not powerful enough to run any piping and it MUST be moved from machine to machine. While the table saw does not challenge it too badly, the 13" planer and the 8" jointer certainly make the dust collector work near capacity. I have never run more than a 10 foot flexible hose from the dust collector to the machine - I would never dream of running piping between 3 machines!

   But in the land of reality, I cannot afford a cyclone yet, so my 1 HP dust collector will have to do; however IF I was buying a dust collector today it would be AT LEAST a 2 HP machine!

   I am puzzled WHY you would spend $295 (CDN) for a Delta at HD when you have so many more logical alternatives in Canada. Busy Bee tools has a nice 2 HP for $395 that is a 2 HP and produces 1596 CFM (maybe 1200 in reality) - so for $100  more than you are prepared to spend AND you get a damn decent machine that CAN handle some limited distance piping between your 3 machines. I know what you are saying - its another $100 - but trust me that is probably the best $100 you will ever spend on your shop until you can afford a real cyclone to control the dust!

   SOOOOOOOOOOO is a 1 HP dust collector better than nothing - I think so. But given your shop's size AND your limited budget - I recommend you don't buy the Delta 1 HP, spend another $100 and get a dust collector that can meet some of your wish list!

   Bob in Calgary

1. 
   SFX | Jun 28, 2007 06:56am | #2

   where can you purchase busy bee tools.  i'm in winnipeg, any leads?  thanks for your comments, thats exactly the answer i was looking for (not what i was hoping for)

1. 
   QCInspector | Jun 28, 2007 02:09pm | #3

   Here you go.http://busybeetools.ca/cgi-bin/homepage?&NTDESC=homepage2.htm

2. 
   ChuckN | Jun 28, 2007 02:18pm | #4

   Hey,

   I usually avoid dust collection threads like the plague so I'm sincerely sorry if I offend any one with this question.

   I have a 5hp Rigid shop vac.  I hook it up to each machine as I need.  It does an excellent job (except sometimes on the router table) of catching all the dust and almost all of the smaller, lower velocity chips.  I bought it for $60.00. 

   So what would be the advantage of a $300.00-$400.00 dust collecter over this? 

    

   ChuckN and I have nothing of value to add to this discussion.

1. 
   questtools | Jun 28, 2007 03:26pm | #5

   Hi Chuck,

   No offense taken and I always look for the most reasonably priced tool that is the best quality I can honestly afford - I learned that quality tools are a logical expense.

   Okay so where does economics come into play in dust collection? I have learned that I cannot use a 1 HP dust collector hooked up to a random orbital sander (ROS) because while it has the volume of air and CFM (4" hose) it does not have the speed FPM to suck the small particles. My experience shows me that the opposite is true - try hooking my Rigid Shop Vac (2 1/2" hose) to my 8" jointer and the shop vac cannot keep up with the volume of chips the jointer can produce.

   The 1 HP dust collector handles lower speed but higher volume of air; therefore, larger machines get cleared easier. My Rigid Shop Vac works best on smaller machines that produce finer dust and less chips.

   I know that the engineers like Bill Pentz and my wife could explain it much better than I can, all I know is what I have experienced. I have had a scare with breathing in to much dust in my shop, and the doctor has warned me that cherry dust is not good for my lungs - I love to work with cherry!

   So I have invested in an air filtration unit suspended from the ceiling and I am saving up to buy a reasonable sized cyclone in the future. Why a cyclone you ask? Because my background in agriculture taught me that the cyclone is at the heart of all combines when you trying to separate the wheat form the chaff - it works! When I can get a cyclone installed in my shop AND I get all of the dust collected at source, my lungs will thank me! Price is a concern, but the question in my mind is not whether a shop vac OR dust collector is the best or cheapest - they are all part of the solution to clean and healthy lungs!

   Have a great day Chuck!

   Bob in Calgary

2. 
   forestgirl | Jul 02, 2007 06:53pm | #9

   "So what would be the advantage of a $300.00-$400.00 dust collecter over this?"  If you can find a 1.5+HP machine for that price (used, for instance; or an bagged model [vs. canister]), one advantage would be not having to move the thing around.  Hook all the machines up, with blast gates.  The amount of time saved, at least in my case, is significant!

   Are you able to collect efficiently and thoroughly from your table saw?  That's the machine that seems to hardest to collect from, and if you're getting good collection off that with the vacuum, you're doin' great.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-) 

3. 
   woodman1549 | Jul 01, 2007 07:00am | #8

   I too have a 1 hp dust collector and I had it hooked up to pipeing but after a while disconnected the dust collector and put it closer to my table saw and planer/jointer.With that set up it works better now and I use my shop vac for  my bench machines. If I had the space and the money of course I would get the cyclone maybe later on. I hope this helps. MarkHave fun woodworking but respect your tools

2. 
   wrighturns | Jun 28, 2007 04:42pm | #6

   I have this unit and I use it for wood turning dust collection.  I have a 10 foot extension and move it to each tool (band saw, table saw etc.) as needed.  It is somewhat noisy so you may not want it right beside where you are working.  the lower bag clamp is alkward to connect and I have had the machine fall over when I was moving the hose. Other than that it works fine. R <><

1. 
   SFX | Jun 30, 2007 06:24am | #7

   thank you all for your advice.  i spoke to a dealer or 2 in town and they basically talked me out of the 1 hp which means i won't be getting one right now, just can't afford to get a decent powered machine.  i'm gonna take my cash and look for a deal on a used bandsaw instead, the little 7 1/2 inch piece of junk i'm using now can't even cut a straight line, i abused it trying to cut turning blanks out of apple wood.

1. 
   frenchy | Jul 04, 2007 07:37pm | #15

   SFX

     try Grizzly on the web at grizzly.com

     $295 gets you a 2 Hp dust collector..

1. 
   Buster2000 | Jul 05, 2007 08:25pm | #17

   Sorry Frenchy... No Grizzly in Canada.  They have some agrrement with Craftex/Busy Bee tools.  Which given the response for Gizzly just don't compare.  Almost everyone I know here that has purchased Busy Bee Tools has had to return them at least once before they got one that wasn't faulty. 

3. 
   miller | Jul 03, 2007 06:44pm | #10

   Thanks for posting this question.  I was looking at the same dust collector on Saturday, and wanting to know the same thing you are.

4. 
   nazard | Jul 03, 2007 07:34pm | #11

   SFX:

   Home Depot's price of $298 is way too high.  I bought the 1hp Delta some time back for $181 to use on a temporary basis until more shop space and $$ came my way.  It worked just fine with a 10' flex hose connected to my tablesaw.  After reading several articles in FWW on DC, I used 5" metal line connecting the saw, planer, and router table.  Works fine for me.  I think the trick is using 5" metal lines and keeping the bends few and wide.

   Best!

   -Nazard

1. 
   SFX | Jul 04, 2007 05:21am | #13

   thanks for all the advice.  i've since priced the collector at around $240 CND at canadian woodworker.  still not sure if i'm going to go for it, save for a 1.5 hp or put the money into a new bandsaw, i'm looking for a used 14" right now, my 7.5 " is pretty much kaput.  reading all the responses has been very educational, always amazed at the amount of collective knowledge i can access so quickly.  Does anyone else have the same trouble saving money as me?  everytime i squirrel money away for something new i end up paying off some debt!

1. 
   IdahoDon | Jul 04, 2007 06:17pm | #14

   I have the small delta and it's been a huge help in remodeling as a ducted fan, but not so much with the bag attached since it cuts down the cfm's so much. 

   Many times I'm taking dust from a room and simply need to vent it outside, which the delta does a great job of if there is a place the sawdust and chips can be blown. 

   When spraying a room with latex or oil simply putting the hose in a window creates enough negative pressure to keep the rest of the house dust and fume free. 

   It also works great after refinishing floors to ventilate the house.

   To dry drywall repairs, the hose on the output taped to a ladder at the right height makes it easy to direct the flow of air. 

   Even with 40' of hose it's a terrific fan without the bag. 

   Beer was created so carpenters wouldn't rule the world.

1. 
   forestgirl | Jul 04, 2007 07:44pm | #16

   "When spraying a room with latex or oil simply putting the hose in a window creates enough negative pressure to keep the rest of the house dust and fume free. "  This is an idea that was recently recommended to me when I had questions about setting up a plastic knock-down "finishing booth" in my shop space.  Glad to see another person who's used it.  So, it sounds like if I were spraying, anything in the air would bypass the motor and not cause problems?   Do you use regular DC corrugated hose, or something else that might be less expensive?forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-) 

1. 
   IdahoDon | Jul 12, 2007 11:32pm | #18

   So, it sounds like if I were spraying, anything in the air would bypass the motor and not cause problems?   Do you use regular DC corrugated hose, or something else that might be less expensive?

   Yep, the air bypasses the motor.

   As for the hose, it's mostly a matter of what you have.  Some old 4" or 6" flex duct with the outter insulated portion removed works well on the exhaust side. 

   Beer was created so carpenters wouldn't rule the world.

2. 
   forestgirl | Jul 13, 2007 04:14am | #19

   Thanks, Don.  I've been eyeing the 8' x 8' pop-up tents (with tall center), prevalent this time of year, seem like one would be pretty handy to set up an enclosed finishing area inside the shop when needed.  When I'm doing a wipe-on finish that dries fairly quickly, it's no big deal, but the latest project was a slow-drying oil-based paint, and whether sprayed or brushed, needed a safe, clean place to cure for many hours!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-) 

3. 
   BruceT999 | Jul 14, 2007 05:13am | #20

   "I've been eyeing the 8' x 8' pop-up tents (with tall center), prevalent this time of year, seem like one would be pretty handy to set up an enclosed finishing area inside the shop when needed. "I don't think that hose-in-window trick would be helpful with your pop-up tent. Suck a large volume of air out of your tent and where would the make-up air come from?...from your shop, along with all manner of airborne dust and lint. What you would want for your tent would be a low velocity fan [so it wouldn't stir up dust from the tent walls, floor or table] pulling air INTO the tent through a good HVAC filter. That way you will put the tent under positive pressure so that air moves from tent to shop. Your very own low-budget clean room!BruceT

4. 
   forestgirl | Jul 14, 2007 07:21am | #21

   Yep, the air flow would have to be figured out for sure.  One tent we saw at the big fundraising sale had a flap-window that coulda been just right for an air intake, with some framing involved.  Just a fantasy for now.  We'll see what pops up (so-to-speak) during sale time at the end of the summer.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-) 

5. 
   PheasantHunter | Jul 04, 2007 05:20am | #12

   Shop the Web if a Delta is what you want.  And you want at least the 1.5 hp with 1 micron filter bag.  You can find that for around the same price delivered from Amazon (in the lower 48).  Don't buy one without the 1 mic. bag.  Check this sight under tool guide for info. on 1.5 hp collectors.

    

   Good luck

    

6. 
   woodman1549 | Mar 02, 2008 05:34am | #22

   I have a 1hp and I had some 4" flex pipe hooked up to it for a long run and I found that with the flex pipe it was just to obstructing. I changed it to 4" furnace piping and was a lot better suction.
   Mark

   Have fun woodworking but respect your tools
7. 
   Don01 | Mar 02, 2008 09:53am | #23

   1. Go visit Bill Pentz' site and get educated.

   http://www.billpentz.com/woodworking/cyclone/index.cfm

   Once you know what you need, you can make choices based of finances, shop size etc.

   Until you get to where you need to be,m make sure you wear a very good disposable respirator - 3M 8293 is a right at the top in performance and price.

   If you end up with one of th 1 1/2 to 2 HP dust pumps, avoid the bag. The cartridge is more money but I believe it will help keep the unit running at the highest rate.

   Hope this helps.
   Don